Tell Me About E46 M3s

"macanamera" (macanamera)
02/18/2015 at 12:36 • Filed to: None

Specifically, tell me about maintenance and repair costs. What is typical? Are there any common repairs that are very expensive? Hit me with some knowledge, Oppo.

DISCUSSION (55)

Cherry_man1 > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 12:37

VANOS. If what I've herd and maybe SMG stuff.

JR1 > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 12:39

BMW forums will answer all your questions. But seriously this is my favorite M3 so buy it.

TheHondaBro > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 12:41

They don't like being submerged in water.

Textured Soy Protein > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 12:41

Beware E46 rear subframe damage .

SMG isn't so good.

I hear the rear window flipper opener motors are kinda wonky.

AM3R shamefully returns > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 12:45

SMG or manual? Let's start with that, manual will give you no trouble at all, SMG may need a pump changed in its lifetime ($2k part). If you want an smg find one that already has had that done.

They are fairly solid, you can daily drive one with no trouble. There was a little problem with sub frames in the early models but that should be taken care of by now, and they sell reinforcement kits if you do buy an early model that has not had that issue addressed.

It will be cheaper to maintain and fix than an E9x M3, and if you choose to DIY it will be simpler as well.

I have lots more info, so lemme know of any questions you have.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 12:46

expensive VANOS repairs and rear subframe cracks are the two main ones I remember from when I was curious about these.

Also, was reading a lot about needing to replace shocks and springs - but not sure how that would be different from any other car - maybe they have a knack for eating through them, and are expensive being an M car?

They're great cars but ultimately I didn't bite the bullet as it wasn't a practical solution. If practicality or running costs aren't your biggest issue and can find one with the main issues fixed (or at least records of it being checked) I'd say go for it! Prices are probably at or near bottom, so good time to pounce. And stay away from SMG - the 3 pedal manual is just much better.

Tripper > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 12:47

Owner of one for 7 years and 60k miles - 2002 Phoenix Yellow 6MT. Ask me anything. Average annual maintenance cost was $2k. I only ever had one failure, a bad ignition coil around 50k miles. Replaced for $125. All service except for an oil change or two was done by a local BMW indie shop.

911e46z06 > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 12:50

Bought mine about 2 years ago. I looked at dozens and had my BMW guy examine about 6 or 7 before I finally found one that looked right. Some problems we found were rust, suspension wear and damage, counterfeit Chinese stock-style wheels, slipping transmission, and some other stuff I don't remember.

If you buy one, just be damn sure it's a good one. I'm glad I did. Since I bought mine, I've replaced about a $25 relay and had the 60k service, which ran like $1500. It's been as reliable as any non-Chevy-350-powered car I've ever owned.

911e46z06 > 911e46z06
02/18/2015 at 12:51

Not a joke: my biggest expense has been traffic tickets.

macanamera > AM3R shamefully returns
02/18/2015 at 12:54

Is it a 5 year/ 125,000 mile Carmax warranty worth it for 4k? On a 50,000 mile car?

Tripper > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 12:57

A lot of people warn about VANOS failures, my mechanic does something I'm going to go ahead and call a VANOS service, in which he replaces the parts that are likely to fail. For that he charges $800 and recommends it every 30k miles or so.

I know a lot of E46 M3 owners and I have never heard one say that they have had the catastrophic VANOS issue.

That is not to say that it does not happen. My fathers 2011 x5 4.4 has been at the dealer for 6 weeks! Entire VANOS system is being replaced and both turbos!

Yossarian > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 12:59

if you do preventative maintenance like checking the vanos, subframe, in time I don't think you'll be spending enough to make up the cost of the warranty.

Volvosaurus-Rex > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 12:59

How much do you drive? If you're going to hit the 125k miles before the 5 years, probably. If repair costs can mean the difference between you eating or not eating, also probably, but you should re-think buying one.

Its a beautiful car and low mileage examples are fetching significant used car prices. I would avoid one that has been "customized" as these are fairly high strung to begin with. Theres also something with the VANOS system that is likely to happen before 100k miles but you would be better off consulting an E46 forum for that.

Officer Jim Lahey is not a real cop > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 13:35

http://carbuying.jalopnik.com/the-affordable…

babydriver > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 13:40

like everyone has said.. vanos and subframe.. both are problems in the earlier cars, but get an 04 or 05 and you probably won't have any problems.

also shifter bushing (manual only obviously). pretty easy replacement and shifts will be much better.

macanamera > babydriver
02/18/2015 at 13:46

The subframe issue doesn't effect the later cars?

RallyWrench > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 14:26

Really solid cars in general, and a truly great car to drive, but finding one that's been properly kept is really hard now.

Almost no one adjusts the valves at 100k. Many of the very first M3s suffered engine failures, which is well documented. VANOS accumulators leak & solenoids fail, but it's not what I'd call common. I've seen a few lose throttle position and cam position sensors. As has been mentioned, SMGs are more problematic than manuals, but while annoying are not generally unreliable. I've seen a couple of hard-used M3s break rear floors & subframes, but no normally driven cars. Rear trailing arm bushings are really weak, and when bad will make the car change direction on acceleration. These are easily upgraded. The differentials are weak on early cars, often making noise. The rear lower control arms are almost always bent in stock form, and are also easily upgraded to adjustable units that allow more alignment adjustment. The interiors are a fairly weak point, with the finishes on the doors, steering wheel & console peeling, and seat bolsters tearing at seams commonly. Worth the time searching to score a good one, because they'll likely appreciate.

magman007 > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 15:39

As an owner of 2 smg e46 m3's in my time, heres my take.

1) dont shy away from SMG. My first car went 96k mi without a single issue with SMG, CEL or anything. I bought it at 50k and a 87 year old lady totaled it. Honestly, I think the manual sucks. Its long and vague. However, in this day and age, SMG is starting to show its age. Down shifts when turning are a bit longer than I remember, upshifts are lightening quick however. DSC off, Fastest shift setting, and break your passengers necks.

a) The trans is the exact same getrag unit as the manual, and the pick ups and mounts are still intact for a 6spd swap should SMG shit the bed. Additionally, the e39 540i uses the exact same getrag, just with a different bell housing. Swap the housing and you're good to swap.

2) The interior is nothing more than a glorified e36 interior. It has aged much much better, but door seals, headliner, and pillar trim is all going to give up on you, if it hasn't already. BMW didn't use the best glues these years. My current car is a unicorn, bought it with 13k mi off of an oldfart in boca raton, it was kept in a climate controlled garage its whole life. Now, 13 years after the car was sold as new, the plastics and glues are still giving up.

3) Owning this car, some 7 years after the first, has been a bit more problematic. I think thats due to the overall time the car has been alive. I have had to replace more sensors on this one than I ever had to on the old one. SO far I have replaced a throttle position sensor (easy) and I am getting ready to do an intake cam position sensor (looks like a pain in the ass) and I need a new pedal assembly. Again, I don't attribute this to poor quality, just electronics starting to fail due to age.

4) run a square tire setup and rotate your tires, or plan on a healthy rear tire budget. its pretty easy to tear through a set in 10k mi with some fun mixed in. Its fairly easy to find a set of OEM rear wheels which fit perfectly in the front, for about $300. when you're ready you will be able to sell a whole square set for about 600 without tires, good luck ever selling the fronts unless you find someone who really wants the look on their non m e46 or an e36.

5) If you auto x, try and find a "slick top" (no sun roof) for helmet head room.

6) train everyone you know to close the doors gingerly. They're heavy but swing easily, and are really easy to over slam, I want to kill the kids who let the kid out of your car in the morning at school, every time its a massive door slam, and I want to protect my window regulators thank you very much.

7) When you hold the unlock key, all of the windows and sunroof will open. Its a cool trick, until you spend 45 seconds waiting for the rear wing windows to close again. These can be coded off during the trick at the dealer, or you can DIY, the programming is supposedly really simple.

8) painted side markers are more expensive than they should ever be.

9) buy some stealth bulbs. Dont buy anyone elses knock offs, the stealth bulbs are the only ones that are truly silver when off. gets rid of the annoying egg yolk look in the corners.

10) be prepared to break a corner when replacing the turn signal bulbs. It will happen, and it will blow out of your car over speeds of 100. Ive done it to both cars now.

11) Enjoy. its one of the best all around cars available. Still retains analog qualities, in a digital world. Last great m3, etc.

Manuél Ferrari > magman007
02/18/2015 at 15:47

omg best comment ever

i learned stuff about my e46 m3 that i didn't know

Manuél Ferrari > Textured Soy Protein
02/18/2015 at 15:50

solution: never open the rear windows! i keep mine shut to avoid breaking the motors.

Manuél Ferrari > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 15:50

bruh

i'll sell you mine if you overpay

2004 42,XXX miles

macanamera > Manuél Ferrari
02/18/2015 at 15:52

Manuel?? You have a e46?

magman007 > Manuél Ferrari
02/18/2015 at 15:58

like what? it has more tricks up its sleeve. :)

Manuél Ferrari > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 16:01

It's Robo-Manuél!

He is nearly as cool as his brother Manuél

I bought it to turn into a weekend track day (bro) car.

But then I got too busy to do track days. And then I didn't want to sell it cause it's so nice.

I do recommend if you're thinking about one. It's like a more usable 911. The back seat and trunk sizes aren't LOL. It feels faster than my 997.2 C2 even though it's not (I think cause it revs so damn high). And it's 1000 times more comfy cause the ride quality is so much better.

It's not as prestigious as a 911. But the flip side is that it's pretty stealth when you want to blend in with traffic.

Manuél Ferrari > magman007
02/18/2015 at 16:03

#7. I also had not researched the wheel/tire options you mentioned in #4. And I need to be mindful of #6

macanamera > Manuél Ferrari
02/18/2015 at 16:03

smg noooooooooo

jk that's pretty awesome

Manuél Ferrari > magman007
02/18/2015 at 16:04

is it true there is a secret launch control feature?

Manuél Ferrari > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 16:06

hahaha yeah

i bought it before i joined Oppo

i had not yet been indoctrinated into the cult of Manuél

macanamera > Manuél Ferrari
02/18/2015 at 16:19

stop having so much money k thanks

Manuél Ferrari > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 16:22

sorry, haha

i guess i could stop working 24/7 (other than oppo breaks) and have a social life. then i could get the ladies like you.

also stop getting pizza with no pork on it k thanks

macanamera > Manuél Ferrari
02/18/2015 at 16:24

it was a margherita pizza bro!!

how long are your hours??

Manuél Ferrari > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 16:38

Which is ... Not pizza!

I dunno how many hours. Too hard to track cause I do work after I get home

AM3R shamefully returns > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 16:45

I wouldn't spring $4k for a warranty unless you plan on daily driving the car long distances. If you're buying a 50k car, you're looking at maybe $25-30ish thousand for a well maintained and fully documented car. $35k is E9x territory

If you get an SMG car and plan on driving A LOT, I'd get the warranty. If you go manual, get a PPI and you should be fine.

Following a good maintenance plan (cooling system at 75k, valve adjustment, etc.) may cost you $4k eventually, but with the warranty you are left waiting for things to break.. Which may not happen until after the warranty ends.

macanamera > Manuél Ferrari
02/18/2015 at 16:46

Hire me! My talents include picking up girls at bars and chugging beers!

Manuél Ferrari > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 16:47

dis sounds like a great idea!

You can be Chief Party Officer

Eli's Got 2 > Manuél Ferrari
02/18/2015 at 16:54

Why isn't that pizza?!?! You liked the veggie one... Didn't you? DIDN'T YOU?!?!?

magman007 > Manuél Ferrari
02/18/2015 at 17:04

for Smg? Yeah.

DSC off.

level ground foot off the brake.

hold the stick forward, and push the gas. The revs will hover around 1500 rpm. Let the stick go and off you go. Throttle application past the 1500 rpm mark will determine just how much fanfare happens. Mat the pedal and you will get some wheel spin, go about half throttle and you will have a bit of squeel and a good launch.

The real hidden mode is burnout mode.

Dsc off

level ground, foot off brake, but keep the left foot near

mat the pedal quickly, clicking the little button past the full throttle . Revs will climb to around 3500 and the clutch will dump. use left foot for brake stand.

magman007 > Manuél Ferrari
02/18/2015 at 17:05

#7 is fun, you can close them all up again too by putting the key in the door and holding it left/locked. why the remote button wont do it is beyond me.

magman007 > Textured Soy Protein
02/18/2015 at 17:05

i never had an issue with them, they just move at a glacial pace.

Manuél Ferrari > macanamera
02/18/2015 at 17:09

Kinja'd!!!

also Manuél is better but you gotta admit that after market paddles make SMG sexy

Manuél Ferrari > Eli's Got 2
02/18/2015 at 17:10

I was good. But only for one slice. Mac is a red blooded meat eating chick slaying man. He needs pork on his pizza at all times!

Manuél Ferrari > magman007
02/18/2015 at 17:11

this is so awesome!

SMG is better than people give it credit for

They forget that there were only a few companies even making automated manuals when the E46 M3 came out. It was very exotic back then. SMG hung with Ferrari's F1 and is cheaper to fix

Manuél Ferrari > magman007
02/18/2015 at 17:12

I'm gonna try it right now!

Eli's Got 2 > Manuél Ferrari
02/18/2015 at 17:13

Oh, is that the rule because you would know. Haaaaaaaaa

Manuél Ferrari > magman007
02/18/2015 at 17:15

it worked!

Kinja'd!!!